145 | The psychology behind successful partner programs with Seema Barman

Jon Busby: [00:00:00] Seima, thank you for joining us on the Tech Marketing Podcast and welcome listeners to another episode. Um, we're very excited to be joined by Seima Barman, a senior manager of Worldwide partner program infrastructure at Juniper Networks. Um, and of course I'm, I'm joined in the virtual recording booth here by my.

Partner in channel crime. That sounds really dodgy, doesn't it? Partner in, partner in channel, let's say, uh, Seb, um, uh, who's, who's gonna be my, my cohost for this episode? So, Seb Sima, welcome to the Tech Marketing podcast.

Seema Barman: Thank you for having me. I'm excited to be here.

Jon Busby: Thank you, John. It's always a pleasure.

We're really excited. So sema, as we were, as we were kind of prepping for some of this call, one thing I found really intriguing is all, and this, this goes for all of us that have found our way into channel. We all kind of fall into channel somehow. It doesn't, doesn't, uh, it's not something we ever do intentionally.

It just kind of happens to us. [00:01:00] And your journey is probably one of the most intriguing ones I remember. Of all of our conversations, which you started in clinical psychology, like how did you. What was your journey from clinical psychology to partner operations?

Seema Barman: Yeah, it, it is actually quite a leap if you think about it.

You know, I was in clinical child psychology when I made the decision to move to an MBA and, um, to me that leap, uh, was not such a big one because it's, it's, it's very apparent that my psychology training would come in very handy in. Partner interactions, right? Any kind of channel marketing partner operations role is, um, putting on that empathetic hat, being able to understand pain points, being able to problem solve and um, and then high interactions, being able to listen to partners interact with them.

So, um, I was very confident that my psychology [00:02:00] skills would be handy in such a role.

Jon Busby: I, I, I, it's something I really wanna make sure I keep coming back to over the, the next, you know, next hour that we have together sema, because I think this gives you a very unique perspective when I think about many of the challenges that we have have today, especially with, with the, I'm gonna say the entropy that we've introduced into the channel.

Recently, like how much more complex we make partner interaction. So thank you very much for joining us. Really excited to be going through some of our points. So, uh, for all of our listeners, we've got kind of a rollercoaster of, uh, of, of partner operations been we're gonna be going through today. Uh, isn't it, Seb?

So we're gonna be starting talking about some of our invisible infrastructure, um, and why it's important to, to build infrastructure that empowers partners. And be talking about touching on trust. And then of course, something that is very dear to, to my heart and to actually one of the last, um, uh, guests that I had on the podcast about mentorship and empowerment of, of both partners and, uh, you know, [00:03:00] of, of all of us in our roles.

So this is gonna be a really, really exciting podcast. Um, SEMA coming back to you like, let's, let's kick off. A partner program, you know, you've, you've actually been on the program side and one-to-one with partners. Right. So how, how has that shaped your perspective on how you help them?

Seema Barman: It, it's interesting, um, I made a pivotal change in my role when I was hired by Juniper Networks, and one of the biggest reasons that, uh, I was hired there is because of the fact that I was front and center with partner marketing, channel marketing.

Um, in pretty much every role I've had in the channel, I've been front and center with partners and, and that, you know, that's a very unique perspective because you are privy to all their pain points. Right. Um, so that's the hat we always need to put on, and that's what my experience led me day in and out in strategic planning [00:04:00] sessions, we heard from hundreds of VARs, ISPs, ts big, big, um, international distributors, what their typical pain points are.

And, um, being in that role actually was a huge value proposition. For me when I was coming into Juniper, um, and actually building that infrastructure, um, it, it was really interesting because with, at every turn I was a huge advocate for partners. Are, are we thinking about their user experience? Are we thinking that it's gonna be five clicks for them before they actually land in the program?

And that brought perspective is actually really come in handy.

Jon Busby: I mean, you, you, you're speaking to the converted here, Sima, like, I think this is, when I talk, I've, I've been thinking a lot about this recently, like this concept of entropy, like we love as a partner program develops. It gets more and more complex and we, we often don't think about like that extra click that we've just asked the partner to go through.

[00:05:00] Um, it's

Seema Barman: the user experience.

Jon Busby: It's, it's crazy Set. It, it's,

Seb Tyack: it's, it's brilliant hearing that perspective where you are, you are putting the partner hat on. I think the challenge we see, particularly in, in big businesses is that so much focus for a partner team gets directed inwards. How do I align with my executives?

How do I get on the IT roadmap? How do I corral and try and galvanize a force to help me? Deliver that experience to partners. And I think it, it's, it needs champions, but you have to have champions in, in your team who are just focused around the partner almost to kind of try and catch that inward looking view and say there's more that we need to do.

Seema Barman: No, I'm, I'm always playing the devil's advocate, like, have we thought about, isn't eight emails a bit too much? We're inundating them with communication. Don't get me wrong. Communication is key to getting program rolled [00:06:00] out, you know, programs rolled out. But what's the happy balance? What's that user experience?

Every time we change platforms, every time we get a new program out, are we thinking about the partner? And that's, I mean, in every room, that's the question that I'm always challenging.

Jon Busby: It, it re, it reminds, it reminds me, Sima of the, kind of this approach that Amazon have, uh, which is they always have an empty chair in every room to represent the customer.

And I don't think we do that enough on the partner side, do we? We don't, I, I'd love that approach of just, at, at least having the partner in the room with you really. So

Seb Tyack: same thinking about that and, and kind of bringing that lens where you are, you are trying to always go how we bring the partner. How have you found that your experience building out kind of a global MDF program, you know, a significant kind of all partner program that you've taken out to market, um, [00:07:00] what are some of the, kind of the learnings I guess you took?

From bringing that partner first lens, when you have to look, design and build out something fairly sizable naturally. 'cause it's financial, it can be quite complex under the surface. But kind of what, what were the, the, the areas you looked at to try and keep it as simple as possible? For your partners,

Seema Barman: and therein lies the keyword simplicity.

So what happens, and I've actually led, um, MDF programs both from the partner facing side. Um, I was heading America's Channel Marketing for um, HGSD and at Juniper I was on the other side of the fence. I was, my clients were the worldwide business leads for MDF. The challenge we have with designing MDF programs, because, um, it's marketing money.

Is is the scale of one to 10, where do we wanna land in terms of compliance, risk, um, audit, uh, trail [00:08:00] and audit proof, and then accountability. And then last, which is not in the least with the least important, it's probably the most important traceability and ROI. Right? Um, and so every program MDF program I've designed is kind of, um, complex.

Those requirements, now it's up to the vendor, how they manage these variables. The more complex we make it, the more comp, you know, we can. Um, I've really designed an unbelievably high risk program at my last two companies, and we are probably 11 on the scale of one to 10 in terms of, you know, managing the risk and compliance.

But we haven't made it simple for the partners. It has been complex for them. So my challenge was I want to be able to be not in audit jail because I own the program in terms of infrastructure, um, [00:09:00] preparation. So we're going to map out high risk flows. We're going to be really compliant safe. How can we now make it easy for the partners to actually be compliant with the As and yet not make it complex?

And the answer to that was make some high risk workflows automated. So every time, um, we designed the MDF program, keep these variables in mind. But then we also go back internally to our infrastructure and technology investments and see while being compliant, while managing the high risk, while managing the requirements of POP, how can we make it easy for partners?

Maybe self-service kind of models where, you know, their workflows are so intuitive that pop pop up. They, they get the requirements of the project activity. Um, very easily. So that kind of, um, perspective is very important when we are [00:10:00] designing new tools and, and one of the big things that I led in my current role was in integration to a more, um, tech savvy SaaS platform that allowed us much more automation, um, into that workflow.

Seb Tyack: Yeah, no, that, that makes total sense. And, and again, it is, it is the, the area that I've enjoyed most about the channel and brought me into the channel was helping our clients think about their engagements with partners as, as delivering services. Yes. You know, that kind of idea that we, we are trying to enable people to, to achieve their goal.

And the best way of doing that is think of it like a service, and that means. Designing something that can be automated. 'cause that's a huge win. 'cause it means it's timely and can be specific and relevant. Um, but also just trying to connect the people, the processes that are gonna happen around [00:11:00] so that it, the, the, the tech can kind of prosper and work inside your business.

Seema Barman: We still haven't achieved the automation, but trying to make the tool easy with intuitive steps, trying to enable a partner with easy to follow training guides, um, trying to have the third party support services, um, and in today's world, um, AI assistance. So that would really empower, enable a partner to stay.

Compliant to do the requirements for MDF reimbursement, but yet make it easy. That make, let's make the workflow easier.

Seb Tyack: Yeah, no, we totally love that. And it's, it's an area, particularly MDF where it's, you know, there's a lot of hoops because there's finance involved in compliance and so on, and it's probably of every transaction that partners have with.[00:12:00]

With a vendor, it's probably the most kind of, um, the, the most steps to complete something. Um,

Seema Barman: yeah, MDF has the highest oversight. It's one of those areas where highest compliance risks. So it, within Juniper we are, um, we work cross-functionally with finance compliance, internal audit, business stakeholders, and then of course the sales.

People feet on the street. MDF makes them look good. So how can we all cross-functionally? And my role works cross-functionally across to make sure that all the i's are dotted and the T's are crossed. But yet are we making it easy for partners?

Jon Busby: So one, one question, and you've mentioned this a, you mentioned this a few times, sema, um, like.

We, you've talked about making it easy for partners, and we, we often say like, how do we make it, how do we incre, make it easy for partners to do business with us? Like I've, I hear this in almost every, [00:13:00] uh, partner and channel conversation or ecosystem conversation out there. Like, if we were to distill that down, what does, what does ease of doing business really mean?

What are the key key points you, you know, you talked about clicks and removing steps a moment ago, but you know, what are, how, if you were to define ease of doing business, how would you define it?

Seema Barman: So, so for me, it really, um, translates into the actionables the partners have to take, right? The investment programs that have almost become like table stakes today in the channel for big two, tier three tier channel vendors.

You know, we have to remember that these, uh, wires, these big Es have are dealing with hundreds of vendors. So what are these actionable? So each one of these vendors, they've actually got to go put in their project, go claim the POP, um, get their MDF reimbursement for rebates. They have to go claim them for seller rewards.

They have to actually, you know, provide that proof of performance to actually claim those. So the actionables are. Really [00:14:00] translate it into simple steps. If we can make it easy for the partners to engage in these programs, simplify single sign on, for example, you'd be surprised It's, it's one of the easiest things to integrate with it and make single sign on.

One click versus several clicks with third party vendors, right? Um, ability to enroll in these programs and be eligible. So that's, it's, it's seems very simple enough for the legal team. They need, you know, terms signed off, but we can make it easier for the partners, right? A single step, single sign on. Um, how can they get traceability and trackability into their KPIs?

That's a big one too. Um, a lot of times partners struggle to see, and they're participating in 10 different programs with the vendor, but they don't have a single plane of glass. And that visibility to see what is their performance without giving them that visibility, we really don't get them engaged. So, um, I think those are, those [00:15:00] are really big ones tho that those actionables, if we can make it easy for the partner, um, that user experience of engaging with the vendor.

Becomes significantly better.

Jon Busby: I, and I read that as single sign-ons a great one, right? Something I've always been passionate about. It was one of the first projects I ever did in the channel. We talked about how we fell into the channel. One of mine was integrating single sign-on for, for channel partners.

Um, but that piece of essentially what you're saying there is like, give the partner. Fewer places to have to go to get all their information. Given that single pane of glass which you com complete, completely agree with. Like Seb, we, you know, this is something we've been incredibly passionate about. Like is there anything missing from that list of things to make it easy to do business with

Seb Tyack: it?

It's really interesting 'cause I think I totally agree about the actionables. You know, that's the thing of like, we are in the channel, we are people working together and there's an element where if you can be. The [00:16:00] easiest business to do that work with. You are gonna have more chance of succeeding with your ecosystem and with partners.

And the importance of it is every, as you said, big partners are working with hundreds of vendors. You know, smaller partners are working with tens of vendors, so. It's, it's hard to be that much better on product and price is not easy. So being easy to work with, we will all go there, like, which is why Yeah.

Service design is, is so important.

Seema Barman: Yeah. And, and when we make it easy to do business, we are fostering that stickiness in the relationship. Of course, the niche marketing, the product value, that value proposition has to come from the product team. But those programs that are going to enable them to uplift that essay, how can we make it easy for them?

How can we foster that stickiness in the relationship? And,

Seb Tyack: and that's where you, again, when you were talking about bringing automation to MDF, [00:17:00] it's such a key. Kind of requirement to step forward. 'cause if, if there was a list of attributes that I have for being easy to do business with, it's being, um, relevant, it's being timely, it's being specific and being actionable.

And so that's why that, that fourth one is exactly the same. But if you do those four things, it means you are taking away, I need to work out what to do. Like, you know, because you're being specific and it's relevant to me. And it's, you know, I need to focus now. And so that's, when we talk about comms, it's almost like, can you tell me something which, you know, is those three things, and then what should I do?

And that's how you, you know, you move someone along the journey of doing business together. Um, and it feels easier.

Seema Barman: Yes. As my call to action clearance, as in right.

Jon Busby: So you mentioned that, so we, we talked about some of our invisible infrastructure there. Um, but you mentioned [00:18:00] something that I think was really interesting, Sima, which was about some of the metrics that you, and data points you need to track and, and why So like.

Let's kind of drill into that because this is all about the visibility and trust side. Like what are the most important, you know, when it comes to designing any program, and we've got here in our notes, it could be MDF or rebates. Um, what are the most important data points to track? Um, and, and why?

Seema Barman: And, um, interesting that you bring this up, John.

A lot of times I will work with my clients, my business leads, and they, you know. We wanna run and launch a program, but are we stopping even for a minute to see how we gonna track the performance of that program? So performance tracking or tracking ROI is very critical whenever we are running to launch a program with MDF.

You know, there simple. Um, metrics that, that go, you know, you know by default, right? You know, eyeballs, conversion rates, how [00:19:00] many people came to the training, that all is very easy and we keep partners accountable, right? For those kind of metrics. But I think the big ones, uh, is m is MDF really contributing to the pipeline and that, and that's a big one and it's still a challenge for a lot of vendors.

Are they really able to, uh, design a closed loop process to actually get that accountability? How the leads we are generating, how many opportunities are they? Converting to, and then how many deal reg? So what is that conversion rate? Right? Um, and, and are we really tracking to see these leads, right? Is somebody really taking the leads from an MDF tool into a Salesforce CRM kind of environment and then somebody really turning those leads.

Cold, warm to hot and following up with them. Then comes the true ROI investment. And, and so that's, that's a big one. So, you know, simple metrics, you know, we talked about eyeballs, lead conversions, email metrics, banners, [00:20:00] training, uh, conversion rate from leads to deal registration. We also shouldn't forget overall operational metrics.

I think that utilization number. How much the MDF utilization number is actually a big one, right? Um, you know, a vendor could be zealous in giving out MDF because it's that red carrot approach again, you know, you want to look good. So you wanna throw out the MDF. How much of that MDF is really the partner leveraging within the parameters of the MDF program.

So that MDF utilization rate actually year over year, quarter over quarter is very relevant for the vendor to track how much are the partners leaving on the table where, which area, which region that will help you actually invest in resources to actually look at the weak and the strong areas. Um, and that's a good one.

And then KPIs for the partner itself, right? Those kind of metrics, overarching KPIs, I talked about that single paneer glass. Is the partner having visibility in all their programs and how are they performing against each one of them? So [00:21:00] those big KPIs for the partners are actually very important metrics for them.

Every time a PAM is sitting down in A QBR evaluating the state of the business, um, you know. Overall sales leaders, they can actually hone in and see which other regions that really didn't perform, they would've done those sales anyway without any investment. Are we really pushing the dial? So those overarching operational metrics are actually very relevant as well.

Seb Tyack: Yeah, I I, it's really interesting hearing, like when we think of that term trust and, and what we're building up, because it goes two ways, doesn't it? Within the business, we have to show that we are delivering some value to be able to say, you know, as a, as a partnership team, as an ecosystem team, this investment, we can show the, the, the, the reward it brings.

And then there's the how do we optimize it? Like you said, utilization, they're, they're also critical, but the, the, the information back to [00:22:00] partners, and again, like we are passionate about it because we have developed services and, and products around that pane of glass. With the partner very much as the focus to start, like how do we take disparate data and show the KPIs, measure those KPIs, and actually make it as actionable as we can?

So what do you need to do to achieve more and, and so on. But the feedback we have from customers and, and the sentiment it drives a partner is that transparency becomes a real underlying kind of relationship value. Um, where, you know, the speed of it, the fact that you are showing all of it, you are not, you know, cherry picking or, or not showing some things.

It, it builds that, that kind of, that ethos I guess of, of being, being good partnerships, um, which is under underly,

Jon Busby: I think.[00:23:00]

Metrics as well. Sima, like there are some items there that you know, you can utilize in lots of different ways to know if you are making it easy for the partner. Like, MDF utilization is one that I've seen come up multiple times. Partly because it could show where you're not closing the loop, partly because it can show, uh, you know, various different accounting behaviors that might, that may be happening.

But also like if a partner's not spending their MDF. Like maybe they've got dropped off and gone with one of your competitors. Um, like have you seen in your, in your experience, have you seen kind of what's been the most interesting use of a metric, um, in driving a decision?

Seema Barman: Um, so one of, one of the metrics we use in a rebate program, you know, um, we, we very creative and we, our rebates program is very mature in, in, in our creativity and the way we target different segments of the channel.

Uh, one of the metrics that we, um, leverage is close to end of quarter, where we actually, you [00:24:00] know, push out, um, a percentage to the partner and saying, well, if you'd really. You are two weeks from and a quarter, and you, you're this far from achieving your base target and, and that number to your bottom line.

And that really helps to turn the dial, uh, in, in the, it, it, it's, it's a potential again, uh, like a red carrot approach, but. That then you were eligible for this rebate. You are literally two weeks from quarter and if they in turn can, you know, push the dial with their sales team to close a deal and actually hit that number.

So in my mind, I'll be honest with you, every metric is relevant, but there are certain time sensitive metrics that really help to turn that dial. And, and having that, the, a service model and a platform that enables you to give that insight to partners really helps you position better in their eyes.

Seb Tyack: Yeah,

Seema Barman: and I'm [00:25:00] speaking from a vendor perspective, right.

You know, the more value that our programs provide, the more data insights that we give to partners, the, the more ability we give them for their performance tracking. It really is going to enable them to be an extended Salesforce more actively.

Seb Tyack: Yeah, and it, it is a great example when we talk about timely, relevant, specific, it's like, because you can translate that into a really simple, like you are leaving money on the table.

If you don't, which, which, you know, and that's in, in business, everybody is motivated to. Build their bottom line, so

Seema Barman: absolutely maximize profitability.

Jon Busby: It's, I I think we've answered our next question, which is, would you say visibility is so essential to the success of a partner program? I, I, I think we've gotta say yes, but what I'm gonna, 'cause it's, it, it's obvious.[00:26:00]

Of course. It's,

Seema Barman: it's really obvious. Right? And, and more than that, right? If you don't have visibility, perform partner, uh, performance, um, how are we going to support? So for example, finance needs to do financial planning. They need to do modeling, right? Um. The different stakeholders need to plan resources for the next half of the year, for the next year.

The data insights into this performance tracking by partner really allows them to do their job so that that data becomes the founding model. For next steps, right? Future financial modeling is depending upon it, in future investments, dependent upon it, you know, all the strategic planning that business leaders do for MDF, they have to go back and see how did that partner perform?

Did they even leverage that MDF? Did they leave money on the table? Which areas did they invest in? Did they turn the dial on the new product launches? That kind of performance tracking. Did the sales actually uplift? [00:27:00] Giving them that visibility. It actually enables them to assign dollars or not assign dollars and see where is the areas they need to tweak.

And you can even do it from a regional perspective. You can do it from a partner perspective, you can do it from a product perspective, but data really becomes the founding step for them to leapfrog Next, next steps.

Seb Tyack: Yeah. Just cannot disagree. It is, you're totally right that it is the, the challenge is taking MDF is that quite often, like MDF programs can run quarterly or even like every six months, sales cycle can take longer, you know, and so there's this element of, of trying to manage those financial cycles alongside the actual business cycle.

Um, but that can be modeled. It can be analyzed if you have data, um. And I think, [00:28:00] again, when we, you're saying visibility and trust, and probably the other area that becomes really relevant for partners is consistency. You know, that sense of things will be changing, but they're not constantly changing. Um, and, and again, we see that with programs that you wanna have stability in the way in which partners can earn, whether it's rebate or however to.

The transactions come. Um, but that stability does require lots of planning.

Seema Barman: It, it does, it does. And we, and we forget that sometimes we try to program is not working, let's change it. And again, the devil's advocate and say, you know, research tells us program has to run six to eight quarters to really get the true ROI, did it really work?

Or it failed? You know, so we may be zealous in trying to, you know, tweak the dial. Okay, let's change it. But again, that, that mention of stability and constancy, that's also [00:29:00] important because we have to remember partners are seeing hundreds of vendors and uh, if we, if we keep changing programs very fast, we are probably losing their trust.

Seb Tyack: That's a really fascinating kind of data point that it will take six to eight quarters. To kind of enable the, the, the, the program to start to prosper. What do you think, why do you think that is kind of the, that, that long? Is that the, the sales cycle or actually seeing the return or it's just the adjustment of businesses to working on a new program?

Seema Barman: I think it's a combination of everything, right? Change management takes time. Learning takes time. Um, MDF and rebates, for example, the, the TAT on, uh, reimbursement and payment, um, is, is a longer sales cycle, right? Um, so accountability, being able to, [00:30:00] um, get that data and, and action that accountability. So it's a combination of everything.

Sales cycles are longer. Um, plus again, and I'm, I'm harping on it. That's the truth. Partners are seeing hundreds of vendors, you know, they're seeing hundreds of training in, in invitations. They're inundated with different kind of programs. We've just trained them. It's taken them two quarters to actually understand the program and can, and log in and download a report and see the nuances of it.

And we change it again, we, they just absorbed it. Right? So think of it from a psychological perspective like they just learned. To walk and now we're changing and, and turning the, the, the running trail again. And, and that, that's, that's the perspective. So it's, it's a combination of everything. Um, the six to eight quarters is a number I heard somewhere, but they, the ad they advocate that new programs should at least run for that number of quarters to [00:31:00] really track measurability on it and really track.

Was it effective or was it just a failure?

Jon Busby: Yeah, co com Completely agree. I think, I think if I was to think what's missing from partner programs with, and the metrics we're talking about, consistency feels like one, because we we're human, I think we underestimate the amount of education training at times.

We have to repeat certain they're meant to a partner program. What else is missing from part, from from partner programs and the, and the metrics in order to build that visibility and trust sema.

Seema Barman: I think the big one is traceability, and I talked about it, right? How transparent are we? You know, eight, 10 years ago, uh, a lot of vendors didn't do, uh, system integrations between the CRM and, uh, the third party services or C-R-M-E-R-P instances.

Um, so that, that traceability, that's single pane of glass, or that's even, you know, for a pam, they had to go here to get. The [00:32:00] source of truth for the partner, and now they have to action the programs in another third party tool or a hosted service or a custom service. So, uh, traceability, providing that, uh, visual both to the internal teams and to the partner is a, is a big one.

I think, you know, if you provide them more transparency, if there's tools are integrated, you know, it, it used to be an exception by eight, 10 years ago. It's almost becoming a business requirement now. Um. I'm seeing more and more of that. Um, and, and it, it, it really helps, um, build that trust that we talked about.

Uh, in the past, you know, um, vendors were more worried about channel conflict. How much granular can we get to expose this essay, right? Two tier, three tier channel models. So that channel conflict was always a, a worry. It still is. So every, every vendor evaluates their own, um, scale of how much are we going to expose.

But again, that data visibility, that single pane of [00:33:00] glass actually enables a partner, actually enables the PAM to sell more, to do better, improves that stickiness and the relationship. So those, those are some things that I think are very key. And as a partner ops, um, uh, leader, I feel integration actually improves, um, user experience.

Um. It, it, it just improves that overall experience both for the partners as well as for our internal teams.

Jon Busby: I mean, it'd be mad you wouldn't, you wouldn't go to Amazon and open your orders and expect your orders to be blank because it's not integrated. Right. Um, we, we just expect that, and I think we sometimes let B2B and channel and channel getaway with lower standards and that will be held against us.

Um, but you mentioned something really important there, which brings us onto like our final section here, which is. How do we make the partner do better? How do we empower them? Um, so, you know, with such a deep commitment to this, to partner experience that we've [00:34:00] discussed today, and it's been. There's been at least three points.

I've earmarked clips, um, and great quotes from you here, SIBA. But you know, there's also a, a personal element to all of this, um, that takes us away from web interfaces and systems. You know, mentoring's been a big personal mission for you, uh, from our prequel. Like, why, why is that so important? Like what, what, how did you land on mentoring and empowerment?

Seema Barman: Um, I, I, I mean, I, I don't mind sharing a personal experience. I was young. Um, I was in clinical trial and suddenly thrown into high tech and I was clueless. I was coming from another country, new culture, um, working for a British company and, um, a little in this little hole in Cby and I was working and I was.

Highly taken under the wing by an Irish woman. I've never forgotten her. I didn't ask for that mentorship. She just saw something in me and she kind of guided me. I've never forgotten Stacy Horseman and, and what she provided to me as an advisor, as a mentor, and a gentle guidance. In that [00:35:00] first new job in corporate world, um, years later, um, you know, in, in, in another big company, I was of course running 300 miles an hour, you know, um, uh, um, working mom, you know, um, corporate world.

And, and, and I, I realized, and I had a team of, um, young, um, adults working for me, and a couple of them were, um, you know. Young moms were trying to juggle so many hats, and I, and I realized, um, how many times we failed to ask for a helping hat. Because we're just, we're trying to, um, climb every hill ourselves.

And, and at that point, I remember Hitachi had initiated this mentoring program where we'd actually, you know, allow, um, fresh graduates or graduates in their senior year to do internships and give them an opportunity to be the first, to apply for new positions and entry level positions and, and mentor them through the process.

Not just a six week summer job, but maybe as. Six month [00:36:00] internship and, and really the, the value I saw, the relationships I developed just sparked this whole, um, interest in me that why can we not give back? Why can't we not share the lessons we learn in, in our journey in the corporate world? And it's brutal out there.

So it, it became a, a, something personal to me and I've been involved in all different aspects. When I join a new company, I look out for such groups where I can be part of, um, I don't mind sharing my challenges. Um. With the younger generation, right. I've already walked that path. I actually, personally, no matter how old we get, no matter how seasons we get, um, always look out for an advisor, um, I, I still go out and run, you know, something challenging through, um, advisors and, and that's, that's what I would pass the message.

You know, don't be afraid. To seek out an advisor [00:37:00] or a mentor. Don't be afraid to share your challenges. Who knows what nugget of information you'll get from someone that might help you in your course of that. And, and the reason I mentioned women is because we're very shy. We, we take on a lot. We excel at multitasking.

Um, but we're afraid to ask for help and we, and we judge ourselves and, um, asking for help. You'd be surprised how many have actually, you know, gone through those challenges and it can open up a whole new, um, opportunity for you out there to learn from their lessons. And who knows, you might be motivated to pass, pass that back, right?

So, um, to, for me, I would encourage women out there, you know, um, seek, seek help, um, share your challenges, share your wins. And build your community. Yeah, build, build each one of them. Invest some time to build a community for yourself, community that you can fall back for, not for your [00:38:00] work, for your work life experiences.

Jon Busby: Such an inspiring message there. Ser actually, um, co completely agree. I'll add the one extra item that you kind of hinted at, um, which is something I live by, is also like, don't be afraid of going outside your comfort zone just a little. Um, 'cause that's where, that's where we learn. As long as you've got the right support network and community around you.

So yeah, really, really inspiring us. Think

Seema Barman: out of the box, actually. Always think out of the box and don't be afraid to ask for help.

Seb Tyack: Yeah, no, I I it is, you said it all perfectly and it is very inspiring and it's also, it, it's that, it's kind of like an honest, it's, it's being honest as well, which I really appreciate.

And I think for me in the channel, it, it. I've met a range of different people that maybe I wouldn't have met in my, you know, social life or in my personal life that I've really enjoyed. And I think lots of the, um, events we've run and, and workshops we've run, bringing people together. [00:39:00] One of the things I found so rewarding is.

Often we're in a bubble of trying to solve problems and understand challenges and run at them. And like you said, it, it, it's really easy to feel like that's my job. That's, I, that's what I'm paid to do, is deal with it. And we are people, and actually what we need to do is work out how to just get it done.

But one of the things that's been so rewarding is being the validation you can sometimes get when you step out of your bubble or when you realize, oh, actually we are not doing too badly. That yes, we can do some things better. Actually we're, you know, it, it's not saying other people are further behind, it's just that sense of you begin to realize what you're doing really well, as well as the things that, you know, you want to do better in.

Um, and that's a positive kind of experience I think that everybody needs just again, to keep confident and, uh.

Seema Barman: Yeah, it's a, it's a big one. Validation, you know, um, it is [00:40:00] surprising that you mentioned that one frequently. I've heard it from my manager that you're not touting your VINs as much as you should.

And, um, you know, um, that's something that, you know, a community will help with. You know, how do you validate what you are doing on a day-to-day basis? How do you, how do you actually speak about your wins? Loud and clear. So you are also able to, you know, apply for that, um, promotion and, and that validation that you are also good enough to rise for a bigger position so that community, uh, that mentorship, that advisor can provide you that leg up.

Seb Tyack: Yeah. No, I, I think it's inspiring and it's, it's nice. Like I said, it's obviously something core in your, you know, your day to day experience now as you want to, to provide that back, which I think is something we can all, we can all look to do. [00:41:00] Um, and I'm sure we'll all get some value from it.

Jon Busby: So bring bringing us back to partners and onto our final question here, Sima.

'cause we've had a lot of your time today. Like we're living in a world now that's moving even far. You've mentioned 300 miles an hour before in one of your previous roles. I think we're going about 800 miles an hour now with AI and everything else on top. What, what does the future of partner infrastructure look like to you?

Like if you were to look forward into the, to the next horizon, what, what does it look like?

Seema Barman: Definitely more automation. Um, I think that every vendor should aspire to, um, you know, give, give partners time back to move away from that basic administrative task to real strategic tasks of, you know, improve the, what can we improve in our strategy and rollout, right?

Um, they have to come back and claim their dollars, right? But again, how can we automate that? Um, so automation, I think ai, leveraging AI to improve support, you know, uh, time to [00:42:00] market. Right. Improving that time to market, leveraging AI right, would be beneficial both for the partner as well as for the vendor.

So, uh, what I foresee is we would get, um, user experiences would improve because we'll bring in more automation, more self-service. Models in areas where can be, uh, you know, uh, automated. Um, we'll be bringing in AI functionality in our support models. A, a place where a partner is logging in just to see, am I eligible?

Did I even get a reward? That that five minutes can be saved by a chat bot, like an AI assistant and can say, oh, you have about 30,000 in reward. And that that time the t and m that the partner is saving is actually going back to do something more productive. So I think more automation, more leveraging ai, more self-service models and, and the biggest one I think is more vendors understanding the [00:43:00] value of serving up data and dashboards.

Giving, giving that, um, empowering that partner to actually be able to look at their performance themselves. So that partner enablement should really improve by leaps and bounds and therein that user experience

Jon Busby: com completely agreed something we are very passionate about. Seb?

Seb Tyack: Indeed, indeed. Like, I mean, it comes back to what we said earlier about transparency and about.

A willingness to show you know, what you need to do to succeed and, and, and provide the information. Um, and with that comes challenges. And it's a process to get there. But if you, if you don't have control of the data, it's very difficult to build automation, to utilize AI in a, in a sensible, secure way.

You, you have to build up to that. And I think it's, um, [00:44:00] it's absolutely critical. And I think the interesting thing that will happen in the future is seeing how far we can go in meeting partners where they are and enabling them to have information to, to take actions without actually having to go, you know, to another site, to your, to your world.

I mean, I think that's the, the interesting future, which is quite complex to think about and how. How to make that work. But I'm sure that's gonna be part of, you know, making that user experience even simpler and easier is, is almost how it can, how we can yeah. Connect it into the partner's world more.

Seema Barman: Yeah. It, it's a fine dance, you know, how much do you expose, how much do you make it easy? And there are nuances of compliance risks and quality and the channel conflicts. There's all those challenges, but I, I think we're. We're getting really in, into that world where the technology will [00:45:00] be enable us to manage those risks and still serve up data that is going to empower our partners more to do what they really were intended to do is sell more.

Seb Tyack: Yeah.

Seema Barman: Yeah.

Seb Tyack: And I think, and, and again, it becomes interesting when you look across the ecosystem of, you know, from the customer perspective and looking at. Customer experience that's gonna happen with your technology through your ecosystem, you know, that that's getting more complicated. But technology and AI has the potential to make that customer, the customer experience, work really, really well.

Um, which is ultimately gonna be. That's what we're That's that's the game, isn't it? Yes.

Seema Barman: That's the dance. We're all dancing. Yes.

Jon Busby: It's Sima. Thank you very much for joining us on the Tech Marketing podcast today. It's been a pleasure to have you on. I've had some real in I, in fact, there's been a few clips that I've captured as we've been going through in a few quotes, so [00:46:00] this has been really insightful for me and hopefully for all of our listeners,

Seema Barman: it has been great as well.

It's such a pleasure to meet both of you. Thank you for having me.

Seb Tyack: Thank you, Seema.